pouët.net

It seems that Greece is no more a geeky country as it seemed to be by the "It's a geek life" thread with the photos! :) But I thing I will bring some other photos to have a laugh! I can't beleive what my eyes see here..

I think I have already told you about the silly law that the greek parliament voted, which found games in any electronic device illegal. They have really applied it now and it's not allowed in Icafes to play any games! (More in http://www.gameland.gr/)

I entered today TheWeb Icafe and saw one of the silliest thing in my life! Some of the tables with lot's of PCs were fasten with the red-white band which says (Passage is not allowed), the usual band which the police puts in places where she investigates! But some of the PCs!!! Just because these were the PC where people were playing games when the police invaded in the Icafe! Only these PCs, closed and fastened with redwhit bands, not allowed to touch(!!!) Ugh.. what a silly shit, as I cannot play in the other PCs now (Well, I cannot play, yeah! Not even watch a demo because if they are so stupid they will not be able to understand that the flashy collorfull shits I watch are not games :P)

I will surelly think to take a photo of this with a camera for you to have a laugh (I will put it in this thread) in the future. I have a digital camera now and so this means very soon!

OMGD can't beleive my eyes...

P.S. Which European country would be nice to stay if I ever leave Greece btw? Suggest??? :)

Try France optimus :)))

Yes France seems to rule (and there are a lot of cool geeks to meet there), that's what also my friend Antitec beleives! Antitec also likes Sweden for some reasons (Though,. I don't think he was there before, yet) telling me they are the most cosmic countries (But I don't know what he means..)

More suggestions? Tell me why or why not, advantages and disadvantages of each place bitte :)

Hmm,.. it seems that I am transforming myownself the old them of this thread, which I myself opened, hehe what a crazy.. (But I will return with photos for sure as this was the reason why I opened!)

I also seem to adore Germany, don't know really why. At the older times I thought it had breed some of the craziest freaks out there, but I also like the sounding of their language :)

scary that i can't seem to find any news in major medias on that greek law against public games... (is it banning even sale and private use of games?)

* No, it's not banning the sale..
* It is supposed to ban even private gaming in the way it is declared all people say, though nobody thinks the police could invade in my home and catch me because I am playing :P

If they would do even such things then the country would go really down because every store sells games and a larga population plays them, from Solitaire to Quake! :)

But they are just cutting the heads of the Icafes now..

More later...

Ohh,. and the main news in the TV that still steals the attention from this silly issue, is the greek police achievements in finally catching a lot of serious 17N terrorists here in Greece. I think even the foreign news have written about these big news, it's a big matter in comparison with the silly law for the moment. But later we will see..

Damn, that really sucks... do you know why they succeeded in passing that law? I have not heard much about that here...
Anyways, there is quite a large Greek community in France...

if you go in France, prepare you to pay!

you will pay 0.50 euros of tax on every cdR you will buy, to send it for the music industry (dont try to explain you will burn some free demos on it, they think you're simply a music pirate)
you will pay about 6 euros of tax on dvdR for the same reason
you will pay about 20% of tax on every part of a computer you buy
you will pay expensive internet connexion, about 540 euros/year for a medium adsl/cable connection, and 360 euros/year for rtc modem connection limited for few hours
the law to put tax on hard drive (25 euros) to feed the music industry is not out for the moment, we put this bad government out of the power of the country, but for how many time?
dont try to search zone1 dvd, it's forbidden to sold it
... etc ...

but if you can pay, you'll be free

AFAIK no media or newspaper or anyone from the mass media has shown anything related to that. The law passed because nobody heard about it and all mass media was busy with 17N.

But there is a trivia (ok, more than one): mobile phones are also computers and they have video games. Politicians doesn't have mobile phones?

...and they say that Net Cafes are not allowed to have games. But what if someone goes to a page with a flash game?

the last and the best is that at parliament's page there is a game for kids! Whan can somebody think? They teach the small kids how to be outlaws... :-)


...stupid politicians...

Come to the USA, where iCafes are more rare than 2005 Chevrolet Corvettes, and you have to give 2/5 of your money to the government, but if you keep your pie-hole shut, nobody will bother you. =P

No really, just go to Germany or Switzerland or Sweden or something... I don't know enough about Europe to recommend any one place, except I've been to France, and it's a nice place to visit, but I wouldn't want to live there. (sorry, nothing personal, France-ians)

yes. move to sweden and experience the extremely weird taxes (i.e. on beers :)

laserbeam: knowing a place as a tourist doesn't in ANY way tell much about how good/bad it is for living

i been to some countries around Europe and i cant find a more fucked up and exciting hole than i'm living in - Riga!

Move to Holland, it's a bullshit-proof country. Has a prime location in western europe, close to everything that matters. And soon there'll be certificates issued by the goverment on demo color schemes. :)

Right, maybe it's time to state what your country is like, I'll start:

ENGLAND: Town centres are filthy, chewing gum sodden, full of tramps and generally crap. The countryside is very beautiful though, and I frequently move my computer to get a better view of the 'side. Tax is 40% of Income for my dad (I am not eligible to pay until I start having income!) plus an additional 11% National insurance for every pound earned. Then you pay 17.5% tax on all purchases, and huge fuel duty. However, it's the only place I know which can't give a shit about music piracy. Sure, they say they hate it, but music (album, not singles) sales have INCREASED! So they're staying quiet to get free publicity. Oh, and with the up and coming UKDP (UK Demo Party) that I should be organising for 2003, you're best off in the East Midlands =) Just don't go to Wales. Or Scotland. There are actually car parks in scotland where males are not allowed to park for fear of women getting attacked! Fucking Scottish! Anyway, I'm moving to Finland when I graduate from Uni :)

sweden is good, but w8 till after the election, if the right parties win dont come here, they will just ruin everything.

The photos I promised to you! Unfortunatelly I was very busy to go home, so I did this html page really really fast here in the Icafe and the comments are only in Greek language. But afteralls the comments are useless! ;)

http://users.auth.gr/~mkargas/omfgd/omfgd.htm

I will only post them to some greek friends now...

Optimus

I would like to give an explanation of what is happening in greece with games.

There was a story few years back with electronic arcade games (proprietary ones) that could be transformed to slot machines just by hitting a switch. There were used in shops illegaly, because slot machines is gambling and you must have a permit to have them. Anyway, lots of people got addicted to that and lost fortunes. The greek society blamed the government for not being able to deal with this issue.

A few years later (today) it came about that the parliament changed the law on electronic gambling. The two points where the legislators failed are the following:
a) They did not have the technical knowledge to understand that computer games cannot easily be converted into gambling ones (where you gain/lose money). So they concluded that potentialy any game can be converted.
b) With the fear of devious greek renegades opening illegal casinos on hair shops, groceries stores etc. they forbid the 'playing of electronic games' everywhere, even in private areas (=your house).

So, now we have a law that is funny and sad at the same time, basically it's not applicable. I read somewhere that now someone can sue Microsoft for bundling games with Windows. Anyway, this is going to create even more trouble and the law will surely have to be revised.

And about france (I am half-french, mind you), I was devastated to see a sign "dancing is strictly prohibited" in a bar, and I got all the details about police invading private parties with electronic music and confiscating all the audio equipment. So, stop dissing the yankees, because they have a saying for this which applies perfectly:

"What, you think your shit don't stink?"

in germany, they WANT to put the same laws that go for public gambling to public video gaming: you have to be older than 18 years, no younger people are allowed to enter, etc. In general, everything that spills blood like hell is 18 years and above only, it may not be officially sold and advertised, you may not even use the word QUAKE in a magazine since that might advertice the game. gamer-parties are limited to 18 years and older, and there is a strong movement inside the german gaming comunity to enforce this before the police gets really curious.

since i am not into gaming this is ok for me. there is a difference between "internet cafee" and "quake-center", and if your internet cafee makes most of its money from gamers then it's using a disguise.

actually, politics turned very hostile towards gaming, especially in germany after that school-massaker. although the reactions are somehow stupid, this is an opportunity for the demoscene to present itself as an alternative. that helps a lot if you want rent a room for a scene-meeting from, lets say, a church, or if you need a sponsor for a demo party. it was very hard to find a sponsor the last years, because the gamer parties were a much better audience for them. but the demo scene is not only art, it's educational and good youth-work.

until you see a documentary on tv showing wasted sceners ;)

I think it will put somre more pressure on gamingbuissness... time to make some fun games again, not this dull quake1 clones, what ever happent to imagination ? :-)

optimus, cool, no more games, now you and the rest of the greek crows (besides ASD) will be able to produce something for the scene!.

We need more countries to follow the example of Greece, Internet Cafes should be used to produce demos, not to gayme ;)

we need democafés ... wich shoudlnt be to hard , since most demos contain pr0n , so it can quickly be made to a demo/pr0ncafé and thereof going very well!!

I mean, everyone codes naked anyways, thats a fact goddamit!