pouët.net

yeah, blah, i kinda formulated it bad. what i ment was rather that the czech scene is a really good example that if people only concentrate on their national thing they don't get too far.

actually i really wonder whats up with the marast orgas.. they get finns with a demo and make a new compo with 1 sole entry for them instead of merging it with the normal democompo, now they get 1/3 of the attenders foreigner and dont even use english. and they're thinking of not organizing the event anymore? its kinda weird, i mean, give inercia the finnish demo and the 1/3 foreigners if you're really not content on how your demoparty is evolving into an international scene event without any seemingly proper dedication...

legalize: zden/satori (and friends) attempted this more than once with demobit parties in slovakia. but still new people did not emerge, so he finally gave up. i guess it's a little bit more complex than having the parties. perhaps the young people just have other things to do.

dipswitch: but 8-bit scene is simply another crowd. they are happy within their own niche, as are we. it's something of a different mentality. but in a sense you are right, there is quite a lively 8-bit scene around here.

zden also has this saying that we (czech and slovaks) are enclosing ourselves within our boundaries and shutting away from the outside world. perhaps there is something true about it.

oh come on ps! we in holland haven't had a decent demoparty for YEARS now! the demozone orgo's are trying their best to get another party of the ground but the dutch scene seems a bit indifferent about it. Still there is a group of dudes here that don't go and whine but try their best to go and visit other parties. not that we are better or whatever. it sucks that the scene in holland quite dried out, but people that do try have a blast at other parties, meetings and whatnot. And i even managed to get some new blood in the scene, beware for a quite kickass limp ninja wilddemo at evoke!

dipswitch, ps: i have been discussing this with marast orgas a time ago. though seeing people from outside coming to local party was definitely nice, the goal was not to make an another international event. the utter desire was to attract more interest in local scene, foremost from people not known of before. and in this respect the party was a failure - as the organizers see it.

i fully agree about the lack of english announcements, which was a major downside. i was translating the important things for Crest, who is german, and afaik among the polish trip there was a guy who understood some czech. there were some rare attempts by organizers to speak english, but overally it wasn't even close enough to what it should have been.

it's difficult.. we tried to do our best, announcements were always fresh on the LED panel (yeah, even in English language : )

the pity is no one from as can speak fluent english - we didnt expect so many foreigners (which was great, of course : )

we planned to make a nice local party, our aim is not making big multinational party..

so... that's my point of view..

dip, pity we couldn't say goodbye to each other, you're a cool guy!

ps the thing with mc demo.. we made that "one more category" decision WITH raimo&dodke BEFORE the compos. they agreed. imho it was really great production, but not PC demo at all. and we didnt want to change the rules in such a drastic way. pls get some info before blaming : )

i guess it's more or less the same everywhere. in 96-98 we had a party in every two months, sometimes even more often; these days we are happy with one per year (and with less attenders than at any of those back in, say, '96)
[[ the scene is dying! dyyyyyyyying!!! die, dead, death, corpse... :)) ]]

flashp: yes, there is a huge amount of things that people can do with their free time now that they couldn't do 10 or even 5 years ago. That translates into working harder for each new participant that you get.

The other thing is "staying power". When starting something new you have to be persistent and not give up. A lot of people blew off Pilgrimage 03 because they didn't think it would actually happen and then they kicked themselves for not going because it did happen. Of course there is a certain scener who was talking about how he'd been to all the N.A. parties at Pilgrimage 03 and didn't manage to make it to Pilgrimage 04, so you never know.

I have been working my ass off doing demoshows and whatnot to get more local attendance at Pilgrimage, but its still not where I'd like it to be. Fundamentally I think I need to reach more high school students and I haven't gotten high school presentations off the ground yet. Still, we advertise locally and continue to do events to bring the scene to new people who never heard of it before.

60 people for a first-year scene only party is good IMO. That's comparable to Pilgrimage 03. You can always draw in more numbers with gaming, but then you dilute the experience from being a scene only party.

The demoscene will always be a niche activity, if only because it expects people to create and not just consume.

kids these days dont have time for computer nerd stuff :)
even the computer nerds only see demos as "interesting", not worth getting your hands dirty with it.

face it,
game industry assimilates all our talented coders.
online graphics comunities are alot more friendly for graphicians.
most netlabels think a demo is a demotape.
traders prefer pr0n and organizers counterstrike.

as if that wasnt enough, anytime anyone tries to include any sense of broader vision into the demoscene concept (musicdisks with mp3s, demoparties with artscene, vjing, machinima, experimental art & science code) its taken as an insult to the cause because "its not entertaining".

even a resurge of cracktro scene gets dissed ffs.

mmm necrophilia i love you.

there is this saying from a portuguese comedian where he claims that opinions are like vaginas. and it's true, regardless of how good yours is, you should always use it more and show it less.

in this case meaning: if you cant say anything constructive, stfu and do better. and if you've done it, then do it again.

mmm necrophilia i love you.

That's because sticking feathers up your butt doesn't make you a chicken. The "resurge" of the cracktro scene has been nothing more than people slapping themselves on the back for doing shitty reruns of what sucks (and get mad when people don't agree with the delusions of grandeur).

Also, yes: Limp Ninja has 2 new recruits and they're better than sliced yoghurt. You heard it first in PS's waahfest thread!

are you trying to convince me to come to amsterdam? ;-)

shifter: thank you for proving my point

Damn... Does that mean this won't make me a horsey? 'Coz I met this cute chick that likes to ride horses, and I thought maybe if I stuck this up my butt she might be more interested in me.

thought i'd just repeat that.

also, ps, i guess indifference is natural to any small worldwide-spread community. don't tell me there isn't a similar indifference to netlabel stuff from other netlabel folks who don't meet each other a lot (say, outside germany or so). for instance.

I heard a lot of positive comments about x2004 (disclaimer: i think that a c64 demoparty can be a decent demoparty, and holland == netherlands for me, even if it isnt true)

who says placing is important? if a guy feels the need to quit the scene again due to some silly comments on pouet and a not-top placing at a demoparty, has he really got the point of the demoscene?

afaik it's all about the friendship and contributing, not winning. and don't come talking about people not showing respect to old legends, everybody gets what they deserve.

it seems that things changed and now it's all about whining :)

havoc, hollowman: oh fuck yeah, ofcourse! sorry for not including x and outline *blush* but since i'm a hardcore pc scener (yeah! YEAH!) those parties are not the first to spring to mind. Excuses!

ps: What point? You try to make so many.

Also, I prefer the statement that opinions are like assholes -everybody's got one.

Lang huxley: and some assholes are more shitty than others

demo or die

i agree with gemini

nula: the led board was a big as a piece of toast! =) i didn't even noticed it until half the compos were over.

anyway, in the next PAiN will be a marast'05 report with all the ups and downs - and there definetely were quite some ups. pancakes for everyone = <3

nula, hope to see ya and your marast colleagues at evoke!

i dont agree with gemini. i think its about getting together with your friends and making something _fucking cool_. (and having a few beers over it and afterwards)

nula, well of course we rather released the demo in its own one-entry compo than not releasing it at the party at all. we would have rather had it in the normal compo with the rest of the demos. but well who cares anymore anyway, the demo wasn't that good.
and about marast, even if most of the people didn't say a word of english we had fun time with boop, el, kombajn and some few others at the pub :)