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I don't know how the discussion shifted into this territory, but sure I'll bite.

Production cost of decent looking short films is an order of magnitude smaller compared to ten or more years ago, and it's certainly seen in the quality of an average music vid. They're more like random art short-film projects, which is far better than the mere promotional videos done for television in the past. There's far more taste and design attention being paid currently across the board I feel. The same kind of independent music videos were far more scarce. Still though... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoqsvmKyhXo, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbyuUvoklBY, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zF7VwQNv9Kk, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCoCTkC0oL0 (the list goes on...)

ps. Funnily enough Die Antwoord is one of the few recent music acts I kind of like.

noby, wow, what a nice bunch of examples. Will have to steal an idea or two!
This is my personal recent favourite: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wycjnCCgUes.

BTW, I hate the sound of Die Antwoord, but the photography in some of their clips is absolutely top notch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Uee_mcxvrw.

This "make a demo about it" thing is a joke. Generally speaking, any demo that's "about" something, is just embarrassing crap. Party invitations are an exception.

I'd prefer good looking examples (the first two of noby's) to that that deliberately look ugly. Eye candy is eye candy :)

/thread

introspec: I mainly like the aural part paired with the visual one :D

proper trashy shit

All the videos were +10 years old, just to make... a point, I guess (don't know what exactly). There have always been great music videos, but I feel they're in a sort of (second?) reneissance currently, at least as far as relevancy to the scene goes. Nice Tame Impala vid btw.

Yzi: so, "fuck concepts"?

Thread derailed alert!

Use YouTube with moderation! :P

concepts are fine, as long as the concept is not delivering some "deep" thoughts or political agenda or something

Humor and scene meta is also ok for me ;) But generally speaking, the more esoteric or nonsensical the "message" is, the better.

Why? I mean demoscene really isn't the best "medium" for that but why should a category be denied of merit automatically?

It was more like my own opinion. My taste of demos, my taste of music...

yzi: hum... delivering some deep thoughts? I wonder what could be wrong with that?

Then, if people like it or not.. they can vote... We know that sometime people might prefer a demo because of one or two things but not because of how hard it was to code... but still, if someone came with a good idea and manage to get 1st place... that's how life is... unfair in a particular event but globally quite fair (everybody experience some joys & pain)...

Well fair enough then. No point in arguing about tastes :)

The problem is, I might completely disagree with the message or find it just shallow or plain stupid. It makes me feel that there's this over-serious guy trying to tell me something stupid or boring or something, and he's not doing it as a joke. And it is annoying. I would like him to shut up and just play the guitar since he can.

http://youtu.be/90QXhl95qP8

Everybody knows what they like to do,
Whatever it is, do it, 'long as it pleases you.
Just take some time and relax your mind,
Then do it, do it, do it 'til you're satisfied.

Whatever it is, 'gotta do it, just do it some more,
When you're through it's up to you to try it again.

BT Express

yzi: ahh.. I get your point... well, I don't really bother too much about that kind of things. When that happen I just do like when there is an advertisement of some sort... I move my attention out of it. ;)

However, I enjoy some story telling stuff like... South Party, Ninja 2, Tribes... Okay, they might not be the kind of things which has deep thought.. but they are not abstract either.

havoc: nope, if you read what i said, i tried to make the point that despite having tools, one still needs to know certain basics regarding the technical shit going on under the hood to squeeze a demo out of them. no matter how much skills you have in expressing your "visual language" with other media like film or clay molding, there's just more to it than just being dragged to a demoparty, get inspired and fire up werkkzeug/unity or whatever.

why is there more to it than firing up unity? we've seen some dutch guys do just that, quite recently.

Tools like Unity etc just save the effort of writing foundational code and dealing with incompatibilities. You still have to make something that people can enjoy. Really the playing field is levelled - you can either code your own engine or use Unity and pre-made assets but in the end you still need to make an entertaining demo. Even sizecoding achievements can be unpopular if the result doesn't look nice.

farfar: but they studied game design, that's cheating ;)

Im starting to hate demo-competitions. Or I've hated it for a very long time, its just that I recently have discovered how stupid it really is to have demo-compos.

rudi: graz. you have taken one first step into transcendancy.

Some of us never stopped calling them demoparties.