pouët.net

rp: expectations arent a BAD thing - either you care about them and make better demos because of this, or you dont care about them and make demos you like. most people understand that they cant satisfy everybody at the same time anyway.

#0: if it's not broken, don't fix it.

So the debate so far: Overall, we like the "becoming rich and famous and people giving us lots of money to write demos all day" part of this idea. We're not so keen on the "destroying the way the demoscene works" bit, or the "actually having to go out and do our own fucking promotion" bit.

oh come on ...
sure most of us would want to make their hobby a profession, but in general thats wishful thinking. and thats no reason to make strange proposals to change rules that worked well for decades.

the core idea behind paniqs initial post was to get more exposure for his productions so he can start a career by doing what he likes (at least thats what remains if you ignore the "win all party prizes" stuff)

but how exactly do you think the exposure will increase when you change the "original release" rule?
now lets say 3000 instead of 1000 sceners see the stuff directly at a party in a compo. that doesnt affect the public or anybody outside the demoscene anyway and therefore helps exactly 0 in increasing the exposure OUTSIDE the demoscene.

so in that sense the rule change proposal is simply bullshit, sorry.

apart from that ... who wants to see competitions made out of the pouet top20 of every fucking category at each demoparty you attend?

Gopher,

that wasn't his intention if i got it right he was more like "not yet released at a demoscene party". Then again there's rob is jarig...

What gopher said but I'd like to stress the bullshit-part.

what hfr said but I'd like to stress the stressing-part.

rp,
even if its more in that direction ... read the first reply to the initial post:

no one and no rule forbids to use your own production again and again at various other festivals (just not again at another demoparty)

and well ... rob is jarig is for sure a special case. but afaik though it is shown once in a while during a compo its just for fun and not selectable in the votelist (aka disqualified) :)

Gopher sums it up nicely, and to add to his point: I have shown his work (after it's initial release) at loads of festivals and seminars, and you always meet people who have never seen them who go "Wooooow!". What on earth would be the point in trying to reach an audience you already have?

Why isn't it good enough that you can play your released demo wherever it's accepted when it has been released? I don't get the film-festival argument AT ALL.

"Hi, I am an attention whore!"

And yes I completely agree with Gopher. It's seriously ridiculous to re-release the same crap over and over again at demoparties.

Errr. hm. err. well.

Well. Yes.

Interesting. Apparently I'm a liberal now, arguing with conservatives. A man with new ideas is of course, always a terrorist at worst, a disturber of peace at best.

I win this thread, and anyone who posts after me is a Douche.

One day, you will find this comment sandwiched in the middle of a dozen pages, and you'll know it is time to do something completely different.

Errr... WAT?

You ignore questions, avoid debate and call yourself a winner?

Nice.

Paniq, it absolutely makes no sense what you want.

I too am making shortfilms - but not for the demoscene.

In the demoscene I release wild demos - and that's it...

The demoscene is so much underground and so noncommercial... everyone who wants to make a fortune with his art should look somewhere else.

And thankfully so.

/me calmly waits for massagin 2

OK. Case closed. Next?

new ideas are not necessarily always a good thing either ...

now go, make a Don Quijote demo about you fighting the windmills of conservative demoscener opinions, and release that at a couple of short film festivals.

if its good, i'll even watch it :)

peace

Dear Leonard,

it's really hard for me to hear, that you are obviously not feeling happy in the demoscene anymore. Since I've been a grown up scener with decreasing releases output, severe creativity blockades and other obstacles like increasing real life time consumption, I was quite a bit jealous (in an admiring way ;-) for you and your very artistic being.

But now I understand that there really wasn't any reason for being jealous at you. You just hadn't arrived where I've already been for some years: beyond the point of when you realize that the demoscene is only a hobby and will not help you to get through life or to make a solid living.
It's been really horrible for me to realize that, but in the meantime I have compensated for those feelings.

Now you might understand, why people like Diver (former TUM-Orga and member of SalvaMea) had to turn his back on the demoscene and went to study art to make films and short movies.

The demoscene is a place where you can express yourself, learn, share and have fun. It's not the place where you could stay forever exclusively and make a living.

And in my very personal opinion (and most probably other poster in this thread) it is wrong trying to convert it into a place where you could do this - just for your personal equilibrium.

Regardless of what next steps you'll take: I thank you for your contributions and the passion you invested for this community that I'll surely be loving forever: the demoscene.

Sincerely,
benJam

Well, as for me, i really like to work in my job thats the opposite of the Demoscene and i dont want to change it.

If you want to get hold of a larger audience, what are 5000 (mostly the same) ppl. at demoparties compared to all persons you can reach via internet? The means are there, you just need to use them.

CONS: 5000x full attention vs 30.000 for a few seconds.

Yeah, Internet fame sucks. It lasts about 5 minutes and is as non-commercial as the demoscene.