pouët.net

I didn't mean to come across so agressive. I just feel very frustrated with the lack of direction, I'm not a coder, nor do i wish to slag off anybody who codes (which i have great admiration for).

I'm an artist, i work within the fields of music, video + performing arts and clothes (not fashion) and graphic design now and again, all i'm trying to stress is that I've followed the scene (on and off) for the last 16 years & i just feel there hasn't been much change. it's fine to create psuedo music videos or the obligatry flying vector stylie type of demos or boring graphics styles that i seen done 2 years before and juxoposing the gritty with the clean, down grading etc... scrollers.. reinventing star fields, bobs or what ever the past had left behide. The point i'm trying to make is, as art form in it's own right, I have never met anybody outside of the demo scene whom are connected with various creative, serious directional movements have ever paused to acknowledge some great moments within the demo scene.
It's a shame.

My previous post was a touch harsh.. the few music artists i mentioned was a bit obvious to some, bad example of how one should not try to plagirze.. but if I was true to my self and had mentioned the likes of... Ken Ikeda, Ryoji Ikeda, Ikue Mori, Glenn Branca, Richard h Kirk, Chris watson, Rafael Toral, Dumb Type, Carsten Nicolai, John Wall, Suzukiski, MIMEO, DNA (post punk circa 1977, NY), Liquid Liquid just to name a few ;) it would of left all of you in the fucking dark... I'm not trying to sound pretentious, but lets start lighting some becons... Many have complained about the so called incoheirent boring noise of Autechre, if it wasn't for innovative creators like KarlHeinz Stockhausen do you think we would have Kraftwerk, Electro-Pop, Juan Atkins(Cybotron), Detroit Techno.. the pulse you hear in 90% of most demos?
Don't be so harsh in the condeming of others.

and some of you had the cheek to tell me to STFU.

shut the fuck up you pretentious piece of shit

(are you happy now?)

Busy bee don't sting me much, stick to your lame st cunt.

havo'cock you haven't got the intelligence to engage your brain towards a constructive retort.

If you had a brain cell, it would die of lonelyness.

i'll take that as a "yes".

i'll go back to my lame st if you go back to knitting clothes (not fashion).

Fuck this, Why do I give a shit?.... I've checked out a few of your websites and stats...

Made me laugh... Quite sad, If this is the souls that govern this scene then it's better off fucking dead anyway... Narrow mided fucks... Wake up smell the bull you lot are fucking shifting...

Stick with the banal.

Havoc, Great name for a Cunt.

Havoc, are a some sad cunt behide a computer all day, romantizing about the great days of demos gone? .... ugly too i supect.

Wanna be big time charley.

Stick to the land of digital communication because in the real world you know you don't have much to show for your self you fanny.

if you want banal, you know you need to come up with better "insults" than that.

but just to make sure you have a good day, i'll rephrase my previous statement:

shut the fuck up you arrogant twat

Havoc tell you what, why don't you stick an atari 2600 joystick in your crack.

it shouldn't hurt you much due to the years of sodomy you've experinced.

After maybe you could try the paddle or the atari mouse...

or maybe get your dad to replay those wonderful years of loving parental contact you loved some much...

why did you respond to my post you half wit anyway? what the fuck do u know? fuck all. your just a sad lamer whose trying to defend his turf... this place gives you a sence of belonging does it? .... open the front door and step out one day, u may enjoy the experince life has on offer you mug.

pahhh... sooo predictable... i wonder when you will come up with a sentence that has both "your mother" and "crack whore" in it...

btw, considering the speed you're typing these messages with... are you greek?

and now, shut the fuck up you egocentric bonehead

crack whore? i mentioned the word crack and you made the connection with your mum? is your mum a crack whore then?..... I'll break it down for u...

Crack = your arse hole..... stick the joystick where you talk from...

If any body wants to suck some rhino cock then please e-mail Havo'cock.....

suckingrhinocock@yahoo.co.in

You can't test me you fucking pussy clut.

*yawn*

you're shit at this game, 10-5 after this message and no signs of improvement whatsoever. hopefully work will be less boring than breakfast was today.

Not as entertaining as wondering why you reply to at all.. don't try and reverse this one on me... your remarks have been nothing but a poor attempt to try to protect this place you call home... i save you the effort by saying goodbye.. remember this,

I have a life outside of this banal static circular movement, nothin but an elephant grave yard...

and your looking for one, if you think this is the place where you might have a life then good on you, everyman should have a sence of belonging... wish you all the best.

This was presented to you in havoco'rama blind vision.
(c)2003 and going back. (o_O)

Now that was comedy. Big thanks to both of you for bringing a smile and a laugh to my first 15 minutes at work, with branca's trademark poor quality insults (perhaps from a book purchased at lidl?) and havoc's simple but effective replies.

Branca: I'm familiar with a lot of the artists you mentioned there, and I've seen a lot of demos + intros with similar style in the last few years. So how are you suggesting we should give the scene some more direction?

Personally, I'd like to see something more innovative such as some ubar-tmar style star-cage rythm, imagine the possibilities for an intro, and think of the crazy syncro you could achieve...

Why do you flame each other here. It looks very ridiculous and immature. Do not waste your time.

Branca: Yep, there are plenty of demos with such kind of music you mentioned here above (and there were lots of them with AE visualisation style too =).
New directions. I think it is only a question of time to find a new style in demos.

Use Demopaja and you can take more control over the style.

Direction my bottocks. The scene is the scene is the scene, and everybody can join and feel free to use the media as they bloody pleases. If your score is to do heavy "to the iron" code, with no design, but advanced techniques...well you do that then. If you prefer flashing layers, and artyfarty design, with nearly no code ...you do that.. The funny thing is, both are very likely to get an audience, that appreciate it, if you put just a little effort into it.

In short... there should be only one rule in the demoscene.

1. There are no rules, do what the fuck you like, but do it well, so you dont bore people with stuff you KNOW should have been in the trashcan dir. if you gave it a 2nd thought.

The scene is about creating stuff on computer hardware, nomatter what that be. You're very welcome to use any loophole you can possible think of (lately windows speach seem popular) If you find a way to do a 64k that uses 700mb of data from the system...Do it...

I honestly dont understand the critisism you put forth man. What direction are you talking about. People do what they like, that is how it always was, and should continue to be...Fcuk the trolls who flash their personal prefferences, by telling others that they cant do demos in demopaja etc., because then its not a "real" demo, or who think a demo have to be state of the art code or has to push hardware to the limits...what is the point? The limits are moved faster than people can push them (in the same sense we did and still do with amiga and c64).

So if you dont like the scene...why bother with it?

Oh and the real credit for being the technomusic's "godfather"...actually goes to a lady. A Danish lady (now in her 80's) was experimenting with electronic music, sampling etc in the early 50's and is still active. To techno producers who know their shit, she will always be the mother (now grandmother) of techno, the one who saw potential in using sound rather than melody to create emotions, and the 1st may i add, to insert a 4/4 bass beat in a song...from 1958. Inly running 80bpm, but to her that was the "heart and pulse" of her track...Can you tell me her name, or did you just mention a list of producers people usually tie to the birth of techno as we know it today?

Personally i would love to see her music in a demo, its so...alive and organic, and if i know her as well as i think i do, all it would take was to pick up the phone and ask her permission. (yeah shes really cool, and attend technoraves, because she loves the sheer energy from the music)

I'm only in half agreement with you there Iblis. If the whole point of the scene is to do what you want and there are no rules, then what's stopping somebody from saying 'I think the scene should move in this direction' and what's stopping others from joining?

Actually, I think it's probably a good idea. If somebody were to suggest say doing demos in high-art style, and many others agree, we'll probably see some incredible stuff in a new style, pushing the limits again but in a new direction. And all the people who think it's a shitty idea, or dislike the style, can, as you said, do what the fuck they want :) Pushing the scene in a new direction doesn't mean the whole scene will go there, it'll just make the scope of the scene wider (and it's been getting wider since it started if you look back).

I just wish people would quit fucking complaining about things not moving the way they want it too and actually do something about it though. I have some ideas for where i'd like to see demos going too, but i don't sit hear saying 'demos are fucking original, go and make some like this for me', I'll wait till i'm ready to act on them and do it.

Btw, who is this cool-sounding lady? I'll have to check out some sounds from her :)

Iblis, would that lady (Else Marie?) be linked to the "musique concrete"
movement? A movement that emerged from WWII with people like Pierre
Henry and Pierre Schaeffer that is often termed to have been very
influential in what we call electronic / techno music today. P.Henry's
pretty old today but has been namedropped a lot by dj(s) and producers.
You can find a lot of stuff on the web on him <-> electronic/techno They
practically invented the sound work we take for granted today, just
splicing/cutting/glueing tapes instead of using samples.

Another big and older influence are the futurists (Pre WWII) notably an
italian musician called Luigi Russolo who was fascinated with noise. He
was basically considering noise as the sound / music of the XXth
century, since it was the century of machines. He wrote a
manifesto
about that in 1913.

Really, what we consider nowadays "modern" music, is just the emergence
in popular music of things that were thought-of and fascinating people
in the beginning of the century that just passed.

Excactly mate. I think that is the very beuty of it. The thing that defines the scene to me is "creating what interrests you on a computer". And if someone want to do something else with it than others, that is all good. If people like the idea, they will follow (jump the bandwagon).
Like with music...someone makes a new branch of music, and others join up because they like it. But it is still music. Same with the scene.

And ...(funny little guy icon) Yes, you know it mate ;)
I do know those people, but to me E.M.P was a main frontrunner for of the pulse driven music as we know it today. I got her remic album, where Danish producers remixed her works, and it is a phat album. You can clearly hear it is her sound, but with a more "modern" drive. A shame she had to turn 75 before she was acknowledged as what she was and did for music.