pouët.net

Ithaqua: Well, I just wanted her to see what's meant to be the largest demoscene only party, but I guess I'll have to reconsider that. She already knows what the demoscene and have seen quite a few prods/photos, so it's not like she doesn't know what to expect.

Sole: I've attended quite a lot of 4-5 days festivals, with hell a lot more musical groups, talks and facilities for 30€, so it's definitely expensive.

Anyway, just giving out my opinion, not meant to whine. I just wanted to know, so I should start to think about wether to organize my easter around breakpoint or not.

Ithaqua: And yes, it makes a difference, I usually spend 200€ on breakpoint (including everything), and I'm not rich, so that little help would make it a little easier, but yes, it's not something we can't overcome :P

how about "prizes to win"? :)

Gargaj: and how would that affect someone that doesn't have any prod in the compos? And, anyway, it's still a 50% difference, wether the money spent on prizes is 20% of the entrance fee :P

musical groups.. but can they rotate a cube realtime?!?!?!?

maali: and do those music bands' image models flash boobs at psychad during the concerts? thats the real question we should be asking ourselfs.

I tried to go to some flash conferences this year and the tickets are usually 300€+ for 3 days, without including hotel, food or anything.

Breakpoint (and demoparties in general) are very cheap for the amount of fun and learning you can get from them. Period.

But did they let your girlfriend in for free? I bet not :-)

Sparcus: In case you can't count, 60€ = 30€*2, so you get two tickets for the cost of one, and with more stuff going on during the festival :P

And it's also silly to call a not-for-profit-event "expensive" - if you want to enjoy the party features a given demoparty has, someone has to pay for it. It's not a price someone has made up, it's simply the sum of what things cost divided by the number of people enjoying it. This can be neither cheap nor expensive.

As a scene we are a sort of family, so it's justified that people help each other. If a scener is unable to afford the entrance fee (poor student, coming from a low-income country), then something should be done about it. That's why we've got social tickets.

But to make this clear: There is a big difference between not owning the money required, and claiming that Breakpoint isn't worth it. The first makes me want to help, the second wants me to tell people to fuck off and go to hell.

And in this thread during the last days we had complaints from only two people...

1.) Someone from the Netherlands, an extremely high-income country. Even a homeless would be able to save the entrance fee during the next 4 months by saving 5% of his monthly social welfare.

2.) Someone from Spain who complains that other sceners don't want to pay for his girlfriend so that she can be bored on other sceners cost.

This leads me to the conclusion that besides the ignored fact that entrance fees haven't been calculated yet and are completely unknown there isn't an issue to worry about at all for the time being.

And in regards of a price-comparsion demoscene-events vs. non-demoscene events: A typical 4 day musical festival in Germany costs 110-150 Euros, a 1.5 hour visit to the cinema is 8 Euros, 2 hours in a public bath is 8 Euros etc.

Heck, if Breakpoint lasted forever, with an entrance fee of 15 Euros per day including space, heating, sanitary facilities, electricity, internet access, parking space, shuttle service, entertainment system staying there for the rest of your life would be cheapest way to live by far. Let's face it: Next to all people from western countries will have higher living costs per day at home than at Breakpoint.

shash: If there are more things going on a music festival that interest you than on a demoparty, then obviously the demoscene isn't the right hobby for you. That's perfectly fine, and there is nothing we could do about it anyway.

There indeed are cheaper hobbies than computers. How about gardening, that's a nice cheap hobby? Entrance fee to the 2008 gardening show in Bingen only is 56 Euros for 4 days, quite a bargain if you ask me! ;)

scamp: I know, it's not my point of view, it's the point of view from someone outside the demoscene. Don't really want to make more from this than it really is: as I already said, I attended 3 years in a row and organized the trip from Barcelona too, and never complained about anything, and I'm not trying now either. If you read so, you really need some vacations, you're getting paranoid.

The comparison was only done, because I'm not rich, and getting to breakpoint is a serious problem to my economy: last year I could barely afford getting there, and this year will be probably worse.

If you really don't want to get my point, then don't. I'm not asking for neither complaining about anything, I was just explaining my point of view. But I guess you can't do that talking about breakpoint anymore...

shash: It's just that 4 months prior to the party, for the last few days I've been sitting here organizing Breakpoint already, especially trying to get more sponsor money as soon as possible so we have something to base our budget plans on. And yes, I might be overly thin-skinned on this, but if someone calls Breakpoint "expensive" and does rather lousy comparisons between Breakpoint and things you can't really compare to it, I feel offended, it pisses me off and makes me ask why I'm spending so much time on this.

From this (my) perspective there is a huge and important difference between someone not being able to afford something and someone not valuing something.

If the entrance fee is a serious problem to your economy then please understand that we've already got a solution to that problem which you should consider: Social tickets:

http://breakpoint.untergrund.net/socialticket.php

"Wants to go but can't afford is" is exactly what the social tickets are for. Unlike "Doesn't think it's worth the money", where the only solution is to not go and do something else instead.

Now there's something to complain about. Why doesn't Breakpoint last forever?

scamp: No, I won't need that. I can afford coming, even if it means hurting my economy seriously, if that's what I/we do in the end. I really don't want to keep discussing this, as pouet isn't (never have been) a place to discuss anything. Have fun organizing

if paying 60euros for getting your girlfriend in to breakpoint is too much, then just take her to bingen am rhein, leave her in the center of the city and give her the 60euros to spend.

nosfe: I don't really get what do you mean, but it's of no use keeping discussing this here, so just let it go.

(a page late, i guess, but anyway: )

shash, i wasn't actually referring to you, but to people like "user" and all the compain-o monks. i don't think you were complaining at all. more like asking nicely, and with good arguments :)

and see you at bp man :) let's drink one on the entrance fee.

oh, granted you do show up i guess. i suggest you do.

skrebbel: I'll try to, as the last past 3 years :P

shash: what nosfe (and scamp before) meant is that it's perfecly possible just to leave her in Bingen and explore the town and its surroundings. It's a really nice area for relaxing and has some very beautiful places, so it's not _really_ necessary to give her a BP ticket. Of course you'll have to manage what time _you_'ll spend inside or outside BP then :)

kb: i've fixed my Bingham ways. God knows why I remembered it like that... slightly embarassed... :)

rc55: Breakpoint's now in Bingham? Oooh, that's only a 20 minute drive for me, rather than 9 hours and a ferry!