pouët.net

Hey all,

There are quite a few demos/intros out there that run on Linux, and I was wondering if there would be call for an apt repository for them...

I'd need permission to distribute source and binaries from groups, and then do some web jiggery pokery to get the listings dynamically generated etc, but it's not that hard.

Ideas? Comments? Suggestions?

apt-get install xmix2004

well, i sure don't want demos installed into the system dirs (tho i guess it might be possible for apt to install them under your home dir)

many groups won't let you distribute the sources
some groups won't let you distribute the (repackaged) binaries

not having to wonder what libraries/etc the demo needs and having apt install them automatically would be nice though

Well, one big problem are the libraries. I was looking through the linuxdemos site and found a bunch that link against earlier versions of GCC- I think the current one (GCC 4) is libstdc.so.6 (I think), whereas these were linking against libstdc.so.4. That's one problem that would need to be addressed, if nothing else by installing some static copy of libstdc.so.4 just for the demos...

There are of course other library dependencies, like old versions of SDL or whatever, but you may be able to deal with those the same way. Either that, or get someone to edit the source code to bring it up to date...

You can also just have it install the demos under /opt- that's what it's supposedly there for (optional, nonessential software). It varies from system to system (I don't know if all Linux distros even set up an /opt folder or add it to $PATH - Ubuntu/Debian at least HAS an /opt folder) and at least once upon a time ALL 'non-essential' software was stuck there (including GNOME and KDE and CDE)

And just in case you didn't know, bb by AA is already in the debian toys repository... It's also in Gentoo's portage tree, and who knows where else. That demo is GPL'ed (and old) though.

Feel free to do whatever you want with the Traction stuff that's ported.

apt-get install amoeba

.waffle: if you're really considering that then I'd suggest to co-op with linuxdemos.org or something :)

crusader: http://www.linuxdemos.org/files/libstd.tar.gz
That's my solution for old libraries used in some demos. "Find 'em all" :)

It's funny that non-native demos are actually easier to run on unix platforms thatn native ones. In most cases, you just need a proper emulator and don't need to hassle with dependencies and shit.

This project is looking harder than I thought - fair enough, you can easily install a demo into a directory under /opt, but then getting the menuing consistent across Gnome/KDE/XFCE4 is a bit of a bugger...

Who needs some desktop menus for running demos?

You're welcome to distribute Fit prods if you wish. Our license is "do whatever you want with the source" - which includes redistributing them with another license if that's a problem :)

.waffle: Isn't demo usually run like all the programs from terminal? I think menus are far from being needed.

viznut: People should at least link their demos statically to avoid most of the compatibility issues in native demos, but it may in many cases raise a problem about violating GPL or some equivalent license. Violation is of course because of not releasing the sources which is the most optimal way to make (even some older) demos to run.

Well I can't totally agree on this linux demo reposity idea. For now I've just downloaded productions from scene.org whether they are native linux demos or not. For windows demos I've used wine/cedega and dos demos dosbox etc...

I think this reposity idea is more like seperating linux demos from the others than binding the demo scene together. Atp repos are very useful when you have some utilities or games because it makes upgrading so easy. There are very rarely any updates for demos, maybe a party and final release but that's it.

And what comes to the menu idea, I don't really like it either. What I condiser demos are more like multimedia performances like videos, songs, flash animations than applications like games and utilities. You don't have menu entries for your every porn clip, do you?

i want menu entries for ever porn clip.

@waffle: That's what the Free Desktop specifications are (hopefully) for. I know KDE and XFCE are at least interested in that standard, though how much... dunno.

And... GL-Rez for Linux has once again frozen my computer (to the point where I can't switch to a virtual console to shut things down).

Variform Linux also seems to crash with a glinit error right after reading the credits. "Graphics... Actor. Dol-ban. We... are... [crash]"(didn't call glinit before calling some gl function; I may have to run it again to find the specific message) but at least I can ctrl-alt-backspace to kill/restart X.

crusader: I've tested glrez in many compilations and never had that crash problem and I just checked the code if I've had forgotten one thing that might have caused that but I didn't.

Could you say some of your system and os specs. Have you watched some traction intros and are they causing the same thing?

Running it fullscreen made it just sit with the transparent rotozoomers and no music, hitting escape froze my system. Running it in a window allowed me to see the demo up to the point the credits showed up; and the system once again completely locked up.

System is a Dell Inspiron 8500, Intel Pentium 4M 2500 MhZ, Nvidia GeForce Ti 4200 Go, Intel onboard (802801 whatever) sound, 512 MB RAM and running an up-to-date Xubuntu 6.06 with all the SDL libraries installed.

crusader: Have you tried to watch traction's intros and do they have the same problem? It would help me a lot to debug the matter if I the answer. :)

It's Full of Stars: Got to the text "It's Full of Stars" (which seemed, incidentally, to have been badly cut out of a block of sample letters- there seemed to be remnants of other objects around the edges) and it faded to a black screen... and nothing. Died.

Ante Dominum: Made it through the credits and the opening scene with the magenta platonic solids; froze somewhere in the cube/plasma thing. I should note, I was running gaim at the same time; that may have contributed.

Stercus Accidit by FiT worked fine
Emo Defect by FiT worked fine as well. (thought I'd mention it; I ran everything I had handy that said blah_blah_linux, which I thought was a traction thing)
Note that I didn't try to exit either of those midway through.

Uh, I'm running the nvidia drivers, with display adaptor scaling set to shutterboxing mode since it's a widescreen laptop. Although the display adaptor scaling is hardware, I think, not software.

I'm going to go find another Traction intro, and retry Ante Dominum with nothing else running.

ssri: Ran perfectly, no errors. (!)

Ante Dominum: This time, it froze before it got out of the credits screen.

Fiat Homo: Froze during the 'connect the atoms' sequence. What's especially interesting about this is that it apparently worked for me in January. My guess? a.) openg and/or nvidia driver regression since then, or b.) hardware breakage :-X

Back in January I think I was using a system with Ubuntu-desktop, Kubuntu-desktop and Xubuntu-desktop installed, usually logging into KDE.

crusader: You may have OpenGL or SDL problem (oh how helpful am I? ;)). I at least don't believe it has anything to do with effects code and NVidia drivers have worked in GF 6600 and FX 5200 flawlessly so you might have some weird hardware problem also.

The things that are common in the intros are SDL, OpenGL and FMOD. SDL and FMOD have a tendency of fscking things up in some configurations particularly in non Windows systems.

Random freezes might indicate the problen being in your nv card. Do you have a power supply that has _enough_ power to maintain it? Have you tried to find older nv drivers and test if they also fuck things up?

Since the intros work in Windows (it's been a LONG time since I've had a demo freeze Windows) I'm going to rule out hardware and power supply defects.

I guess now I need to locate old nVidia drivers and get them working under Xubuntu Dapper... starting with... the one that worked in January.

Install windows. That will solve many linux problems.

Urgh. apt repository for demos? What comes next? A Demo-InstallShield for Windows? Bleargh!