pouët.net

tomcat,

hungarians who where _there_ said they were hooligans. You could even hear the well known "ria ria hungaria" where else than football matches can we hear that ? Anyway wouldnt it be a better excuse for MSZP to say that they were right wing and Fidesz fans ? Why did they go for this stupid lie ?

you know a revolution is more than five thousands ppl in the kossuth square. a revolution is more than a directionless rage. Hungary wont change form of state or goverment because a few thousand ppl went out of their mind.


btw, you are free to believe in what you do. Some ppl believe in god, you believe you live in a nazi dictatorship.

Do I have to remind you that Hungaria is the name of our country, and shouting it at a football match is nothing else but rooting for our team?

Who have you talked who was there? Some spectator from the other side of the Kossuth square? A news reporter? Have you seen what the media has not reported? People tortured by the police in the prison? One of them was me. Say, you wouldn't need anything else but read my blog. You understand the language, don't you? You're also free to think what you want, but speaking out from behind the TV is not quite more than zero.

Meanwhile some stuff for German readers.
http://www.gulli.com/news/blogger-in-ungarn-nach-unruhen-2006-09-27/

It's nice to see gulli.com has published Ghandy's article about Tomcat. It's also interesting that they didn't care about political correctness and translated "gypsies" to "Zigeuner", which nowadays is considered politically incorrect (just like "nigger"). Long live the freedom of speech.

your blog is like the bible right ? the holy truth.

One of the entrys is bullshitting about one of my friends, so I can draw some consequences about your writings.

They are called roma, you IQ-Adok-champion you. And what about them, Tomacat, should they be exterminated?

No, it's not the Bible, but should I explain why one should read both sides before building an opinion? What you're doing is the general media consumer reaction: defending the loudest voice as if it was your own.

Gipsies, by the way, are an alien nation in Hungary, and is expected to behave like the other 13 minorities. Nothing more. Can they?

I keep checking your blog, but you still havent upped a writing about the whole story.

And you don't expect me typing all day and night, do you? As I said, we'll assemble a book about all these things. That needs interviews, research, and so on. I am typing the blog right now, about my own experiences, but don't expect anything more than some memories.

woops :)
ahwell, you know i didn't mean it bad :-) like, definitely *less* bad than them people who actually think they know what they're on about and calling you a neonazi (i, honestly, don't have much of a clue; i'd just think it fun to have a friendly cozy neonazi in the scene so in some odd way i'm sad that apparently you disagree :-) )

so, sorry! i take it back, and won't do it again (or, at least, not without informing myself, which i won't)! let me offer you a beer on tum, ok? (if you're going there).

Slick answer (perhaps a bit cryptic). I got to give you that.

tomcat,

well, we dont agree in nothing but I rather stop this here. I guess you have enough problems without me bitching here.

Nah, I don't care your bitching, take a look at what's going on some certain Hungarian political forums. :)

For being a neonazi, well, that'd require me being a National Socialist, which I am not. (However, I don't see the reason for calling them "neo"-nazis, as we don't call the punks "neocommunists" either, so it's quite stupid.) Also I wouldn't have friends like Bacter, for example. If one judges me as a Nazi just because of my outfit, well, that figures this and that about himself, not me.

Tomcat, no one was concerned about your outfit. Skrebbel previously wrote about your views on Gypsies.

Even if I were a racist, that wouldn't classify me as a Nazi.

heh. lot's of talking in here. welcome back tomcat.

Funny enough, before logging on the Internet, I read on ORF Teletext today that Hungary has 13 ethnic minority groups and wondered which these could be. I won't recap my speculations here, but quote facts from http://72.14.221.104/search?q=cache:Hud9go-rgukJ:www.kulugyminiszterium.hu/NR/rdonlyres/92701E81-C320-417A-A686-38BC98DBF68F/0/etninem.pdf+ungarn+13+ethnische+minderheiten&hl=de&gl=at&ct=clnk&cd=1:

Roma (gypsies)
Deutsche (Germans)
Slowaken (Slovaks)
Kroaten (Croats)
Rumänen (Romanians)
Serben (Serbians)
Slowenen, Wenden (Slovenians)
Armenier (Armenians)
Griechen (Greek)
Bulgaren (Bulgarians)
Polen (Polish)
Ruthenen (Ruthenians)
Ukrainer (Ukrainians)

Well, I didn't expect a lot of Armenians, Greek and Bulgarians to live in Hungary, but apparently they do. The other groups were obvious.

What's funny in this context: Tomcat calls the gypsies in Hungary an "alien nation". But in Slovakia, there are a lot of gypsies, too, and I've read that many of them declare themselves as "members of the Hungarian minority group"...

Gypsies and racists are currently not a major issue in Hungary. The riots had basically nothing to do with the Gypsy question.

Oswald brought up football hooligans, because it seems that the people who participated in the violent part of the riots were the same faces who show up at extremist demonstrations and take part in football vandalism - so the show that you've seen on CNN was apparently not quite related to those who understand the political situation and demand the resignal of the PM, but to these trouble makers.

Every immigrant group is considered an alien nation in any country where they don't assimilate. For the Gypsies, well, they had various fairy tales about their origins during their history. The English name, "Gipsy" comes from "Egyptian", because they spread that they fled from Egypt, where they were slaves. The German name "Zigeuner", or the Hungarian "cigany" comes from the Bizantian "athiganos", which means "outsider" or "ignorant to law".

For the football hooligans, they are the current monster in politics, but they just cover the fact that our hooligans are little lambs compared to British ones, for example. Sure we have some troublemakers, associated to certain football teams, but they are not more than 40-50 people. And we never had killings in football arenas, like in England. Do you actually think 50 people defeated an entire battalion of riot police?

For Adok:

There are quite a few Armenians here, since centuries. For example, the Hungarian Nazi leader, Ferenc Szalasi, executed in 1946, was also of Armenian origin. Greeks are actually communist political refugees, who arrived to Hungary in the 1970s. They even have their own village, Beloiannis. Bulgarians have arrived in the early 20th century, mostly as gardeners and farmers. The closest half-Bulgarian I can introduce you is my girlfriend, Athina.

There are various theories about the origins of the roma people. I myself have not heard about the Egypt-theory but since there are no written records no one will know for sure. One popular theory is that they originated in India.

However, the romas have been living in Europe since the middle ages and are thus not "alien" to any nation. Just because an ethnic group is in minority it doesn't make them alien.

ooo-ooh, i'm an alien, i'm a legal alien!

I'm an Englishman in New York :D

the egyptian theory is not a theory of their genesis but something that many people in the middle ages believed since some sinti leaders pretended it.

and i absolutely agree with el topo on the "alien" thing. aren't hungarians themselves "aliens" on that territory btw? they came there from behind the ural in 400 ad according to a theory. so who cares?

and being a rascist is in NO WAY "better" than being a nazi.

But a racist may be opposed to violence and pro democracy. By contrast, a Nazi wants to exterminate the people he doesn't like and wants to establish the rule of a dictator.