pouët.net

Exactly - turn up for work, get pelted with rocks by hooligans. Have lunch, beat up a thug. Go home. Repeat. Ad nauseum...

chudik: http://www.bitcoin.org/

ps: I was talking about "official" currencies, of course. BC is different, it's community-controlled. Comparing it to plastic cards and PayPal is like comparing Perfect Dark or trackerless BitTorrent to iTunes or Netflix. It's a nice technology, it will be inevitably popular among certain groups. And the governments will desperately try to suppress it once it feels the treat. I won't be surprised if Bitcoin is declared illegall.

*once they feel the threat

You know who else obseses over banks, fiat currencies, and "fat cats" running long term (usually retirement) savings? Troofers from here and here.

Easy fix: require substantial down payments for all loans, even government loans. Currency/sea-o-federal-debt/sup-prime force feeding for "affordable housing" issues solved.

well if it's that easy, go ahead and do it…

The apple rots eventually.

So feel free to start a census to prove me wrong. Most of my grief is based on the word of expats from that very nation, along with people trying to start a straight, uncorrupt business there.

Go ahead. Amaze us all with with profound insights from the people of Greece.

Once you are in the country that is ;)

Shifter: ει αναγκαίον είη αδικείν ή αδικείσθαι, ελοίμην άν αδικείσθαι μάλλον ή αδικείν. - Σωκράτης.

It is important for people to understand that, what is taking place here in Greece now, will take place in the rest of the EU...

What exactly is taking place there?

"Keep in time or gtfo"?

Yeah, so you base your opinion on the behaviour of all people of a nation on the (50-100?) opinions you shared with some expats, and propably the articles you read on Bild and Daily mail. Good. I've spend most of my life there, have property, pay taxes and generally follow what's going on on a daily basis. I read the newspapers, the blogs, watch talk shows, visit about 5 times a year. What I know is that there are very many people that are stuck in a loop of unfair taxation even when they've never stole or abused the state. There are people who are genuinely talented and efficient in what they do for a living, yet, because of the way things run (and there are many reasons for that) they are punished. What is happening there is collective punishment - I agree that this should have been sorted out earlier though.

Calling for an all out attack on the people of Greece (or Spain or Ireland next) is just not on.

Consider the only alternative to collective punishment ... good luck arranging the logistic nightmare it would be to individually consider each greek citizen's personal financial situation to determine whether or not that individual should contribute to the solution. Especially since it will probably wear off after a few years. Then you'd end up with half the country's citizens paying one rate while the other half paid another. Now there's you next riot!

erm, it's not a logistical nightmare at all. It is rather straightforward to tax those who need to be taxed, rather than apply "poll" taxes to everyone (by lowering the tax threshold, for example, to 8k euros from 12k).

what Navis said above.

Navis: That's true in a no-corruption, hard to trick tax-system. I doubt that's the case in greece. Figuring out who paid less tax (and if it was due to corruption or deliberate cheating) in retrospect is quite a bit harder than making sure everyone pays the tax they should from this point forth.

... And as I understand the situation, the introduction of a higher tax for all is what is the root of the chaos. Most of the population demands that the higher tax should only be applied to those who contributed to the financial problems. Determining who exactly that is, is what I think will be close to impossible.

An excellent article on this subject.

There are countries (like France, where I live) where escaping taxes can be done through many legal ways. But it's only possible for rich people or companies. Guess who pays the bill ? I'm really hoping we manage to get rid of that plutocratic system. The sooner the better.

Why not outsource this thread to India, they will give you correct answers eventually.

that's why i'm always saying: kill off all greedy people.

Have you tried turning it off and then back on again?
On a tangent - will we see the Yanks rioting now that they have austerity measures.